Comments on: Elmar Vogt’s new Voynich blog… http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/01/15/elmar-vogts-new-voynich-blog The latest news, views, research and reviews on uncracked historical ciphers... Tue, 07 Feb 2012 19:49:52 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v= By: jonah fowl http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/01/15/elmar-vogts-new-voynich-blog/comment-page-1#comment-12406 jonah fowl Wed, 18 Nov 2009 12:30:16 +0000 http://www.ciphermysteries.com/?p=634#comment-12406 the sample I added is very simple, with replacement by symbols would be really hard to figure out. Hint: set words in order by their length.... the sample I added is very simple, with replacement by symbols would be really hard to figure out.
Hint: set words in order by their length….

]]> By: nickpelling http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/01/15/elmar-vogts-new-voynich-blog/comment-page-1#comment-12404 nickpelling Wed, 18 Nov 2009 12:13:43 +0000 http://www.ciphermysteries.com/?p=634#comment-12404 :-) Did you manage to decipher the similar-ish one from 1641 I posted up (slightly modified) at the bottom of <a href="http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/11/11/voynichese-biliteral-cipher" rel="nofollow">this page</a>? <blockquote>Fildy, fagodur wyndeldra rogered ifsec ogure rantebrad</blockquote> Enjoy! :-) :-)

Did you manage to decipher the similar-ish one from 1641 I posted up (slightly modified) at the bottom of this page?

Fildy, fagodur wyndeldra rogered ifsec ogure rantebrad

Enjoy! :-)

]]> By: jonah fowl http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/01/15/elmar-vogts-new-voynich-blog/comment-page-1#comment-12403 jonah fowl Wed, 18 Nov 2009 12:09:10 +0000 http://www.ciphermysteries.com/?p=634#comment-12403 Manual cipher are fun. Here one sample: ryp i togr acodeb nc c eac ookisad ocumentu od sedforimp odep aphy, ntains tablefor lementinga ookco alookup codingand Manual cipher are fun. Here one sample:

ryp i togr acodeb nc c eac ookisad ocumentu od sedforimp odep aphy, ntains tablefor lementinga ookco alookup codingand

]]> By: nickpelling http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/01/15/elmar-vogts-new-voynich-blog/comment-page-1#comment-12398 nickpelling Wed, 18 Nov 2009 11:32:39 +0000 http://www.ciphermysteries.com/?p=634#comment-12398 Don't be disheartened - hunting for doubled letters is one of the oldest cryptological tricks in the book. Cicco Simonetta even noted (in 1474) that the only word with a tripled letter was "uvula" (because u and v were written the same in Latin), though that may not be particularly useful. :-) Voynich researcher Marke Fincher recently posted to the VMs list about the mysterious behaviour of double "d" (basically, it normally appears towards the end of a line), and it is curious observations like this that may well help to find some corner of the Voynich cipher we can prise up. But the suggestion that Voynichese is a simple monoalphabetic substitution cipher was pretty much known to be false as early as 1930 (and the 16th century person who tried to fill out a deciphering column on page f1r didn't seem to do much better). Don’t be disheartened – hunting for doubled letters is one of the oldest cryptological tricks in the book. Cicco Simonetta even noted (in 1474) that the only word with a tripled letter was “uvula” (because u and v were written the same in Latin), though that may not be particularly useful. :-)

Voynich researcher Marke Fincher recently posted to the VMs list about the mysterious behaviour of double “d” (basically, it normally appears towards the end of a line), and it is curious observations like this that may well help to find some corner of the Voynich cipher we can prise up.

But the suggestion that Voynichese is a simple monoalphabetic substitution cipher was pretty much known to be false as early as 1930 (and the 16th century person who tried to fill out a deciphering column on page f1r didn’t seem to do much better).

]]> By: jonah fowl http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/01/15/elmar-vogts-new-voynich-blog/comment-page-1#comment-12397 jonah fowl Wed, 18 Nov 2009 11:25:51 +0000 http://www.ciphermysteries.com/?p=634#comment-12397 Just an idea. Just an idea.

]]> By: nickpelling http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/01/15/elmar-vogts-new-voynich-blog/comment-page-1#comment-12395 nickpelling Wed, 18 Nov 2009 10:32:38 +0000 http://www.ciphermysteries.com/?p=634#comment-12395 Ah, the "o kees chary ytaly alaly" phrase. It's true that (e and i aside) there aren't many doubled letters in the VMs, and that this is one of the 354 instances where y is followed by y (only 40 of which are inside words, though). For comparison, there are only 26 -dd- instances in the VMs. What I'm trying to say is that the low instance count of "yy" falls well short of being enough evidence to say that y enciphers one of s/t/u. Sorry! Ah, the “o kees chary ytaly alaly” phrase. It’s true that (e and i aside) there aren’t many doubled letters in the VMs, and that this is one of the 354 instances where y is followed by y (only 40 of which are inside words, though). For comparison, there are only 26 -dd- instances in the VMs.

What I’m trying to say is that the low instance count of “yy” falls well short of being enough evidence to say that y enciphers one of s/t/u. Sorry!

]]> By: jonah fowl http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/01/15/elmar-vogts-new-voynich-blog/comment-page-1#comment-12391 jonah fowl Wed, 18 Nov 2009 10:16:47 +0000 http://www.ciphermysteries.com/?p=634#comment-12391 in http://www.voynich.com/folios/f73v.jpg under the crossbowman there's a word "9---99--9". I always wondered if 9's would have been s,t, and u. So it would be simple cipher with offset in sections.It is simple enuff. in http://www.voynich.com/folios/f73v.jpg under the crossbowman there’s a word “9—99–9″. I always wondered if 9′s would have been s,t, and u. So it would be simple cipher with offset in sections.It is simple enuff.

]]> By: Welcome to the whacky world of Wilfrid Voynich… « Thoughts about the Voynich Manuscript http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/01/15/elmar-vogts-new-voynich-blog/comment-page-1#comment-930 Welcome to the whacky world of Wilfrid Voynich… « Thoughts about the Voynich Manuscript Thu, 22 Jan 2009 20:36:55 +0000 http://www.ciphermysteries.com/?p=634#comment-930 [...] thereafter (obviously, else it would be an event of the future) Nick Pelling wrote a very kind review about my blog. He even went as far as calling me “a friend”, regardless of the fact [...] [...] thereafter (obviously, else it would be an event of the future) Nick Pelling wrote a very kind review about my blog. He even went as far as calling me “a friend”, regardless of the fact [...]

]]> By: nickpelling http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/01/15/elmar-vogts-new-voynich-blog/comment-page-1#comment-856 nickpelling Sat, 17 Jan 2009 16:06:47 +0000 http://www.ciphermysteries.com/?p=634#comment-856 Good question! But rather than squeeze the reply into this small margin, I've posted it as a continuation here:- http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/01/17/german-zodiac-woodcuts Good question! But rather than squeeze the reply into this small margin, I’ve posted it as a continuation here:-

http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/01/17/german-zodiac-woodcuts

]]> By: infinitii http://www.ciphermysteries.com/2009/01/15/elmar-vogts-new-voynich-blog/comment-page-1#comment-828 infinitii Fri, 16 Jan 2009 17:39:35 +0000 http://www.ciphermysteries.com/?p=634#comment-828 "...for the Sagittarius page, for example, how it was suggested long ago that the zodiac motifs might well have largely been copied from a (probably 14th century?) German woodcut calendar..." Do you have any sort of cite for this? I'm assuming it's from the mailing list, but I can't find it using any combination of search terms. My own theory about the Voynich involves German illustrations, and this could be immensely helpful to me if you can recall where you heard about this. “…for the Sagittarius page, for example, how it was suggested long ago that the zodiac motifs might well have largely been copied from a (probably 14th century?) German woodcut calendar…”

Do you have any sort of cite for this? I’m assuming it’s from the mailing list, but I can’t find it using any combination of search terms. My own theory about the Voynich involves German illustrations, and this could be immensely helpful to me if you can recall where you heard about this.

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